It’s tremendously easy to waste money with Facebook ads, yet we’ve heard so many successful entreprenuers talk about their success with Facebook Ads. So what can we do stack their cards in your favor?
Our guest today, Kurt Bullock, walks through a proven blueprint that any store can use to yield better results with Facebook Ads by leveraging content to grow your Shopify store.
Kurt Bullock is the founder of ecommerce agency ProduceDept, creator of TargetEcho and HelloSocial - which are tools for marketing agencies, and - he's someone we work with on a daily basis at Ethercycle.
- The content-first approach that lowers ad cost and increases conversions
- How to use video to remarket to customers
- How to find ideas for content
- Hacks to improve your relevance score
- Kurt’s one tip: “the best advertising is invisible…”
I want to send you a sample chapter of Ecommerce Bootcamp, absolutely free.
Tell me where to send your sample at ecommerce-bootcamp.com
Kurt Elster: Hello, and welcome back to The Unofficial Shopify Podcast. I'm your host, Kurt Elster, recording from Ethercycle Headquarters, outside Chicago. All the way, up in the clouds, on the second floor of the historic Pickwick Theatre building. It's pretty cool, [inaudible 00:00:13]. Anyway, today, we are talking about getting more traffic to your store, using Facebook ads. Certainly, we've talked about Facebook ads, before. I think, we've made the case for, "Here's why you should be using Facebook ads." We've talked about a few ways to do better Facebook ads, examples of how to do Facebook ads. And, today's, is really no different.
One of the things, you know, in doing Facebook ads for a couple years now, we've discovered, you have to view the Facebook ads, themselves, as a sales funnel. There is no one ad, that's just going to print money for your store. Sometimes, that works for people. God bless them. I wish them the best of luck, if they can manage that. But, for most stores, the trick is to increase the total number of touch points with a customer, by using your Facebook ads to segment your audience, based on the actions they take on your site. And, then, shepherd them through, walk them through that relationship, from not knowing who you are, to discovering who you are, and then buying your product.
It takes time. The more touch points you can have with someone, the more likely they are to buy. That totally makes sense. It's the way human psychology works, right? We talk about human tissue, and selling. It is very much like dating. That initial purchase is getting married. You're not just gonna run up to somebody and say, "Hey, marry me." That's what a lot of Facebook ads try to do. Today, we're gonna walk through an example sales funnel, that we have lovingly dubbed, 'The Content First Sales Funnel.' I think it's very clever.
The discussion will be led by, none other than previous guest, Kurt Bullock, who is the founder of Ecommerce Agency Produce Department, creator of Target Echo, and HelloSocial, which are tools for marketing agencies. I use Target Echo. And, it's someone I work with on a daily basis, through Ethercycle, through my agency, and it's been hugely successful. Kurt does ... It's a little confusing that we're both named Kurt. But, Mr. Bullock does a fulfillment for email marketing setups, Facebook setups, Facebook ads, retainers. It's, all around, full of good and useful ideas. So, I said, "Oh, we gotta talk through this, on the show." So, Kurt, thank you for joining us.
Kurt Bullock: Absolutely. Thanks for the wonderful intro. So, talking about content for sales funnel, what does that mean?
Kurt Bullock: So, content for sales funnel simply means, using content to drive people to your products, and to increase ... We use an advertising to decrease the cost of advertising, and getting a sale.
Kurt Elster: So, rather than just, you know, the go to, and this makes sense, and it'll seem straight forward, is you have one ad ... This how people used to do it. You have one ad, it's an ad for the product, they click the link, it goes to the product, and that's it.
Kurt Bullock: Right.
Kurt Elster: Now, it's traditional. And, now, that approach doesn't work so much, anymore. And, it's expensive. So, what you're advocating, instead, is what?
Kurt Bullock: Right. Sending your cold traffic, direct to go to a product page, sort of, the highest way to get a customer. The most expensive way to get a customer. We propose using content, first, to help you gain trust, and to help people raise their hand. We like to use behavioral indicators, throughout our marketing funnel. So, this gives us a way to get people to raise their hand, by reading your content. And, then, we can target them, nurture them, with a combination of email, and Facebook ads, in a funnel. I set up my Facebook ads on funnel, just like an email autoresponder. So, we have, sort of, all the same layers, and same messaging.
Kurt Elster: It's clever, but it's a little abstract. I can wrap my head around it, 'cause, you know, we've been doing this long enough. But, walk me through an example.
Kurt Bullock: Sure. I was looking through Buzzfeed the other day, and I came across ... We're doing this ... Well, we're not actually doing this. We've been talking about Whole30, because we do Paleo stuff in my family. This recipe Facebook ad caught my eye. Said, "17 recipes that actually got me through Whole30." That was the Facebook ad, on the front, to pull traffic. I click on that ad. In this case, it took me to a Buzzfeed page. Somebody had paid for this article to be created, on their behalf. There were links, all the way down, of different recipes. They had Pinterest posts, that were embedded, that sort of thing. At the bottom, was a recipe for piña colada mix, and a link to a third party site. This is the person that paid for this article to be created. Once you click on that link, you're taken to that third party site, and it's all dedicated to Whole30 meal planning. There was an offer to get a free, seven day, Whole30 meal planning guide, with email opt-in. From there, after opting in, I'm put on an email nurture sequence, and Facebook ads would target me until I make it to that final stage, which is a purchase.
Kurt Elster: I love it. What you're doing here ... If you download the free sample of 'Ecommerce Bootcamp', ecommerce, dash, bootcamp, dot com, link in the show notes. The first chapter is 'Sales Through Education', which we, lovingly, turned into a program called 'Seducation', right? That's what's going on, here. You're educating. You're giving away value in the form of an article. That article, even if I don't purchase the piña colada mix at the end, is the article still valuable, and useful to you?
Kurt Bullock: Right. It needs to be, to be effective.
Kurt Elster: You're asking them for something. You're asking them to buy something from you, to share their very personal credit card, and home address with you. You're asking for a lot. I think, that's what people have to realize. Up front, you need to give them as much, or more value, then you're going to be taking. So, you've got ... You're leading with genuinely useful content. In the past, people would create content, but they're certainly not paying for ads to drive people to that content. Here, we're challenging that mindset. We're making an ad, that just goes straight to content. And, you say Facebook's gonna charge me less to do this?
Kurt Bullock: Exactly. There's a couple reasons for that. I'll give away some more ideas about this later on, on the Podcast. They'll charge you less to do this, because Facebook loves content. They love promoting content, and people love reading and promoting content, if it's good content. I just read, when I was just keeping my eyes open, before this Podcast, I clicked through a different article, that was sort of a similar format.
When I got to the page, it was a certain camera manufacturer. And, they outlined somebody's journey, through the day, with this particular camera. It was very painful to read, because every other paragraph says, "And, so and so uses the camera model to take pictures on the day, and uses the special setting, which is great for the active lifestyle this person had." It was an ad, and it wasn't useful, or valuable content. So, a couple paragraphs down, they'd lost all credibility, and that's important, because that's one of the main goals of this first piece of content, is to drive up trust, and credibility.
Initially, your cold traffic doesn't know who you are. They don't trust you. Without trust, making a sale is very expensive. So, that's one of the primary objectives of this first piece, is to engage people emotionally, if you can, on some level. Whether, it's educating them, or entertaining them. And, then, hopefully ... If nothing else, you have got them on your retargeting list. You can continue to re-target them with ads, and try to get them to that next step in your funnel. Which, in this case, would be an opt-in, or they could go straight through, and make a purchase, as well.
Kurt Elster: Recapping a little bit. We wanna use content first, because it's gonna build trust. But, the content ... It has a lower ad cost. In doing that, we're going to build higher quality traffic for our retargeting list. And, maybe, they'll go directly through, and buy. But, they probably won't. I mean, if you have a one percent conversion rate, one out of a hundred will, right?
Kurt Bullock: Right.
Kurt Elster: But, the highest converting stores I've seen, use this approach. Like, if I see a store, and they go, "Oh, yeah. Converts at ten percent," I don't even need to ask. I know, immediately, there is some content piece that they're getting the traffic from. And, it could be something on their own site, on a separate site, something they paid for. But, those are the sites where they have primed the traffic. It just converts tremendously well. Then, they're spending way less on customer acquisition cost, because they're using genuinely valuable content.
I gotta create a piece of content that is useful to my customers. Useful to my potential customers, ideally. Is genuine. There's no ... It does not feel like a sales pitch. The sales pitch is totally secondary to it. What else?
Kurt Bullock: That's very important. They did some research in the last couple years. This group, I think it's called, 'LAB 24', that did some research. They actually found that, as long as you are able to make editorial integrity primary, that people actually ... Conversions were better, than if it was a product sale's primary message. It's important to people, that it feels like real content, in order to keep that trust level up.
Another way to do it is, video. We've talked about video, before, on this Podcast. But, video's a great way to do it. You can follow a really similar structure with video, where, now Facebook ... Before, you would need to take somebody off of Facebook, in order to pixel them, right? So, you would wanna host a video on your own blog, for this strategy. Now, Facebook lets you pixel people, right on Facebook's platform. You could run a Facebook video ad, get people that watch a certain percentage of that video, let's say, and then, Facebook can put them into an audience, so that you can, then, re-target those people, and continue down that same funnel.
Bring them to your product page, bring them to a lead magnet page, and collect their email opt-in. There's lots of different lead magnet concepts, and, I guess, top of funnel concepts. Now, you can even target people that engage with your page, and your posts. You could keep the posts on Facebook, if you wanted to. But, in terms of our clients, we've had the most success creating something, typically off sites, when it comes to blogs, so the content could be a little bit richer. 'Cause, Facebook doesn't let you make it a real nice, like, article reading place, right? It doesn't format it very well for articles.
Kurt Elster: Yeah. It's okay. It's not great. I like to send them ... As long as you send them to site that's totally responsive, that's gonna look good, regardless of device. 'Cause, Facebook traffic's probably 80 percent mobile. You could see this, in the stats, people who do tons of Facebook ads ... At this point, a majority of track is mobile. But, it starts skewing much stronger toward mobile traffic.
Kurt Bullock: Yeah.
Kurt Elster: So, always check that out on mobile.
Kurt Bullock: It's interesting. If we look back at one of our shared clients, PrairieMod, for example, right? They sell pottery. When we first started working together, we were trying to come up with a strategy, and we ended up using one of their most popular blog posts, and creating a PDF download out of it. It was 'How to Choose the Right Vase for Your Room.' That wouldn't have come to me, right off the bat. If you do a little bit of thinking, then, you can come up with a piece of content, or a blog post, for essentially, any store, or any topic, as long as it's useful. It was, actually, a very successful campaign. It drove down the costs of purchase for PrairieMod, and did very well for them. You can generate content for pretty much any type of store.
Kurt Elster: Very good. I'm taking a couple notes, here. What's the best way to come up ... It's easy to say, "Hey, you need to make content for your store to sell your stuff." How do I do it? What is the approach I should take, here?
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. Good question. I like to use a couple ways. One is, BuzzSumo. I know, that's a product that you use, as well. But, BuzzSumo's a great way to do research. For those of you that aren't familiar with it, you can type in a keyword, or some phrase, and it's gonna give you all the most shared articles on the top social media sites. This includes your competitors. You can actually type in their specific URLs, and find what's performing best for them.
One thing I like to do is, to check out the way that they create their titles. How are all the titles formatted in that top 10, top 20 list? And, then, that's a great way to get hints. Another way, I use the Google autosuggest, which is essentially, when you go into Google, type in a search, and it gives you those little lists of suggestions, after you've typed in the search term. Scroll down that list, and see if there's any phrases that might clue you into a direction that you could take with your content.
That's two quick ways. BuzzSumo has a free ... You could do that first search for free. Actually, I guess, you could get those first 10 results for free. Anybody could use that.
Kurt Elster: Yeah. I like BuzzSumo, is nice, and it'll give you some basic stuff. I really like the top 10, are what's gonna be most useful to you. It is valuable, if you wanted to pay for it. SEMrush can do some similar things. It's more focused on, "Hey, let's find back links." That's, also, useful in itself, if you could find the back links. 'Cause, you could often find, like, "Oh, this is ... " You get interesting article ideas, that they've got published on external sites. I find that useful for doing competitive analysis. If BuzzSumo doesn't yield something, then I'll usually ... Like, something obvious. Then, I'll combine it with SEMrush. The Google autosuggest trick works a lot. The only caveat is, it'll try, like, Google ... If you're logged in, Google's gonna try to tailor the results to you. Usually, it's fine. It's totally fine. But, someone on my email list called me out. Or on, like, a YouTube comment. "Look, well, you have to do it in the Incognito window." "Okay, fine." I mean, it's not gonna, like, hugely change the results. But, if you wanna make sure it's not tailored to you, open it up in a private window, or in Incognito window, so they can't do it.
Kurt Bullock: Right. Also, if I may talk just a little bit about, as you're executing this strategy, relevance score. Relevance score, for those of you that aren't real familiar with it, when you run ads, Facebook gives you a score from one to 10, that's going to, essentially, tell you how engaged your audience is with your ad, or how well your ad is resinating with your audience. This is all because, a few years back, in the wild west of the early days of Facebook, advertising a bunch of wily internet marketers were promoting aggressive ads. It got a little bit out of control. Facebook's very concerned about their user experience, right? They figured out that they could use this score, that shows advertisers how well your campaign is doing, in terms of, "Are people sharing it, commenting, liking it? Or, are they pressing the 'Do not show this ad' button, in the upper, right hand corner of the ad?" It'll give you that score. If you can manage to get that score on the upper end of the scale, Facebook will reward you with a lower CPM, which is a way to measure the cost of your traffic. This is a really important number to monitor, as you're running these content campaigns, at the top of your funnel.
Kurt Elster: What affects the relevance score? It goes one to ten. The lower it goes, these ads are gonna cost me more. It implies they're not effective. How do I get a perfect ten on a relevance score, and how realistic is it to do that?
Kurt Bullock: Yeah, so, initially, for me, it was not realistic at all. I would never get tens, and I really struggled with making it happen. After I really started paying attention, and doing some research, I came across a couple methods that help out with this. One example is, if you create your ad, and instead of creating it in the ... If you start by putting it as a post, on your Facebook page, then you can take that ad, run it with the goal of engagement for a few days, right? The idea, here, is to try and get some social proof on the ad. If you can get people to comment on the ad, give it some thumbs up, and boost that relevance score, and you can see that go up. Once you've got that score going up, a little bit ...
More than anything, I'm just looking for those engagement cues, that it's being shared and commented on, then ... I usually show that to a friendlier audience. That would be the followers of my Facebook page, or warmer targeting audiences. People that are most engaged with my brand. I wanna go for the easy audience, that's gonna help me get some of that engagement on there. After I've done that for a few days, then, I like to move it over, and start sending that to wider audience of traffic.
I found that that has brought me from, sort of, the six, to seven range, on average, is where I was doing, a lot of times. Eight, as well, depending. On a retargeting ad, it's really easy to get higher score. But, on a cold ad, an ad to cold traffic, it can be really hard to get a higher score. So, this trick, if you first get some engagement on that ad, and then move it over ... You can do this by pulling out ... It's called the 'Post I.D.' You can pull up that little number, or you can search for it when you're creating a new ad. You select 'Use Existing Post,' and find that same post.
Then, you can run it, using the traffic, or the conversions objective, as you normally would. But, now, it's gonna convert better, and have a higher relevance score. That's, actually, made a really big difference, bringing me up to the nine, and sometimes, 10 range, for cold traffic, which, is pretty awesome. It makes a big difference on the price of your ad campaigns.
Kurt Elster: All right. So, to recap. I gotta come up with an idea for an original piece of content. I can use, if I don't have an idea already, I can use BuzzSumo, SEMrush, and Google auto complete to try and come up with a title, and a topic. Once I've got that, I'm gonna create the content, be it, I create it myself. I hire somebody off Upwork. Something to that effect. Then, once I've done that, I wanna make sure the content is not sales-y at all. It's gotta be genuinely educational. It can't be this affiliate, nasty stuff. It needs to be genuine, and authentic, and real, and helpful. Then, at the very end, I will link to, if it totally makes sense, then I'm gonna link through to the offer. To my product page, to a lead magnet. I got that out. I'm gonna post it, as to my Facebook page, then I'm gonna grab my post I.D., use it to create a Facebook ad for that post, run it to a warm audience. By doing that, I'm juicing my relevance score, 'cause it's gonna go up. They all start at five. Then, as people engage positively with it, by liking it, by adding comments, by sharing it, it's gonna go up, six, seven, eight. That's gonna bring my end cost down, and establish, like, "Oh, this is a positive thing you should check out," when it starts showing up in, like, total strangers' Facebook feeds. Correct?
Kurt Bullock: Tah-dah. Yes.
Kurt Elster: Okay, cool. Now, what do I do, then? I've got the ads running. It doesn't cost me much, it's got low quality score, or a good quality score. People are going to this article. I'm just spending money. I'm not getting customers. What am I doing? What do I do next?
Kurt Bullock: After that, you're gonna wanna have retargeting ads that bring people to the next stage of the campaign. I use retargeting ads that bring people to, if I have a lead magnet, then it's bringing them to that lead magnet stage. If not, then, you can bring 'em right to the product page. I've got an outline for everybody. I usually use a three stage funnel, at the very top. This is for cold traffic. We'll bring 'em to a lead magnet. That could be an email course, whatever you have as a lead magnet, and then to the product page, at the end. Does that answer your question?
Kurt Elster: Can I build custom audiences off of this traffic?
Kurt Bullock: Yes.
Kurt Elster: People just go, like, they visit the ad. What's the custom audience for that look like?
Kurt Bullock: Got it. What I would use for, if I'm doing the blog post, I would create a custom audience of people that visited that blog post page. That's the most general way I would do it. If I had a lot of traffic ... [crosstalk 00:22:11]
Kurt Elster: Yeah. Simple. Straightforward.
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. If I had a lot of traffic, then you can use one like that. But, it takes the top 25 percent of people that engage on ... So, by time spent. That's another way you could do it. The simplest way, take everybody that visited that page. Then, I would use that audience, and send them the next stage of my funnel, which would be sending them to my lead magnet.
Kurt Elster: So, lead magnet, email opt-in offer, what does that look like?
Kurt Bullock: In terms of building a custom audience, or the lead magnet, itself?
Kurt Elster: The lead magnet, itself.
Kurt Bullock: Lead magnet, itself, I've had a lot of luck with checklists, can be really great. Or, purchase guides, like, let's say, a recipe guide. That was one of my most successful campaigns. We created 40 different recipes for this essential oil company. They like to mix and match oils, and put them together, this way. We had 40 of those recipes as a downloadable PDF. Another great way to do it is to have some sort of email drip. People could opt in, and maybe over the next three to five days, it's dripping out content every day, that kind of takes them through your ... Teaches them about your offering, and offers value. At the end, then, you would want to redirect them to your product page. [crosstalk 00:23:31]
Kurt Elster: Why not do both? So, I go, like, "Download my PDF." They download the PDF. It's a checklist. It provides value. Maybe it's pretty, maybe it's not. You could buy a template, you could hire a designer to put it together. But, as long as it provides value, who cares?
Kurt Bullock: Right.
Kurt Elster: From there ... I think, people, kind of, they overemphasize the importance of design. And, I say that as a designer. Step two, we say, "All right. You got your lead magnet. Keep it. You can unsubscribe right now," or, "Stay subscribed, and I will send you my free email course, over the next five days, seven days, whatever it is." Then, follow up that lead magnet with this email course. Now, we're in their inbox every day, staying top of mind, building trust, giving them opportunities to reply to us, and say, "Hey," you know, which questions. Then, hopefully, ideally, purchase along the way. We've radically increased the total number of touch points, at this point.
Kurt Bullock: Right. That's perfect.
Kurt Elster: I think that's a clever way to do it. I suggest that, because that's what my lead magnet is. I have a couple, that, no matter what, it's, "Hey, here's your quick hit of info. Here's your PDF. Stick around. I'll give you an email course, and follow up with you, and you can hit, 'Reply.' It goes to me. I'm a real person. I'll answer your questions." Then, from there, then, "Okay. I'm just gonna follow up. You're on my regular newsletter, and I'm just gonna followup with you a couple times a week." It builds engagement. Especially, for like, higher tech items. You don't know where people are in the sales process, in the sale cycle. You don't know when they're ready to buy. You don't have to worry about it. It just happens. At that point, then, I really provide a lot of value to them. I could run a Facebook ad, that finally, just sends them to the product page.
Kurt Bullock: Right. Yeah, you're absolutely right. It's a wasted opportunity, once you collect their email address, to not put them on a nurture sequence, and continue emailing them. Then, yeah. You want all those things to point to your next largest offer. So, your product page. Whatever that next product is. But, it shouldn't be the focus of your content, right? It should, sort of be, a result of your content, is that they would want to check that piece out.
Kurt Elster: That makes sense. Geez, I don't know. I mean, that alone, that's a ton of info. That's a lot of strategy we just dumped on people. You have ... Well, wait. We were talking about The New York Times, and how they were employing the strategy. Can you share that example with us?
Kurt Bullock: Yeah, absolutely. The New York Times, I think, it was October of 2016, purchased a few Ecommerce properties. You may have heard them. [crosstalk 00:26:13]
Kurt Elster: Such as?
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. Sweethome, and The Wirecutter.
Kurt Elster: I love both of them.
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. Great sites. So, they are using this same strategy, right? So, they're coming up. They spent a lot of time on their content. They usually do a lot of research. They employ experts, and they do all sorts of testing, and they usually document their testing, in the article. So, you could see they've got, you know, 20 pressure cookers lined up, or something like that, and they're testing them all out. Then, their strategy is to make recommendations, and they are monetizing this, by sending people to Amazon links, or Home Depot links, and getting an affiliate fee on those purchases.
Kurt Elster: Yeah. Which is, like, it's seven percent. But, they don't have to do anything. They do no fulfillment. I guess, as far on Ecommerce's side, there's no customer support. There's no fulfillment. There's kind of a cool model. But, yeah, man. Wirecutter and Sweethome, people go to them, because they trust 'em, because there is genuinely valuable content. Like, I go, and I'm like, "Yeah. This review totally makes sense. Helps me make a decision." I go there, like ... It's cool. So, the concept works. I know what they're doing. I know full well, the way it works. I totally trust it. I totally buy into it. I've never seen them use Facebook ads.
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. They're not ... I don't believe that they're using Facebook ads to push people to this ... I haven't seen it, either, that way. But, I think, that just the model works. You can see it. You know, if you wanna study how to do this yourself, you go look at the bottom of The New York Times' website, and look at all of their promoted content, right? The articles that are there, because people are advertising. Study the way that they do those, and you can see for yourself, which ones are well done, and, which ones aren't. Also, go to Buzzfeed, and these other sorts of sites, and study the way that they create their articles. That's a really good way to get ideas for your store.
Kurt Elster: Also, a good idea. You have a download, you have a bonus for people. It's free, so they can try and do this, themselves. Tell me about that.
Kurt Bullock: Yeah. So, I've created a few maps of this strategy, because it is a lot of content that we went through on the Podcast, so far. It maps out, visually, the way that the funnel works, and then give you some spaces to, sort of, fill in the blanks, and come up with your own content first strategy. Tells you which custom audiences to build. The whole thing's mapped out. I have two maps built. One is for using blog post content, and the other one is for a video style content, using video views. You can download those maps at produce ... The link is, produce d-e-p-t, dot co. That stands for 'produce department,' slash content, dash first. [crosstalk 00:29:14]
Kurt Elster: I will put that into the first ... Produce department, dot co, slash content, dash first. I will include that as the first link in the show notes. I took notes on all of the links you've mentioned. So, we've got those in here. People can grab those, check that stuff out. And, to go further over it, we're gonna go over Facebook funnels, in a upcoming webinar.
Kurt Bullock: Right.
Kurt Elster: In the next coming weeks. So, keep an eye out for that. Sign up for my newsletter. Kurt Elster dot com. I'll promote the webinar there, or join us in our Facebook group, where Kurt Bullock is also active. So, you can ask your questions there, as well. And, other than that, anything else you'd like to add? Anything you wish it restored, or would do? Anything like that?
Kurt Bullock: Well, I think that this is the direction that the people are going. People don't want to see ads, anymore. Research is showing, the best type of ad is, essentially, or advertising, is invisible. Right? People don't want to see blatant advertising. At least, not until they know who your brand is. And, later on, the advertising can be more blatant, and it serves a purpose, because you are interested in the product, you know how it could enhance your life, if advertising is done well. I think that this is the direction that people should be going to. To start simple, just start experimenting. You can do this with very little down, in terms of ad spend. Five bucks a day, to give it a test. Post, again, as Kurt mentioned, in the Facebook group. I'm happy to answer questions, and help you through it.
Kurt Elster: Very good. Thank you for joining us. You have absolutely ... You've opened the kimono on the very saying, sales funnel process for Facebook ads, that people are presently hiring us to implement for them, in their ecommerce stores, and seeing effective return on investments on these ads, which is fantastic. Typically, you know, any kind of marketing, any kind of advertising, is an investment. Like all investments, carries a risk. But, approaching it this way, coming at it, knowing what works for other people, experimenting with it, wildly helps you reduce that risk. You're gonna be less frustrated, spend less time, and less money, getting to those positive ORY campaigns. Once they're running, they're evergreen, because they're based on peoples' actions. You could, typically, run them for quite a long time, before you have to modify them, when they start becoming ineffective. Right? Yes?
Kurt Bullock: Yes. You're exactly right.
Kurt Elster: Fantastic. That concludes this episode. Thanks so much, for everybody, for your attention, your reviews on iTunes, and your comments in my inbox, and on the Facebook group. However you found this episode, you can find out more about it on Unofficial Shopify Podcast, dot com. It's where I'll link all the show notes. If you'd like to be notified when we post a new episode, when the webinar's coming up, sign up for my newsletter, Kurt Elster, dot com. Shoot you an email, whenever we post a new episode. Of course, if you'd like to work with us on your next project, you can apply at Ethercycle, dot com. Thanks, everybody, and we'll be back next week.